A Domestic Violence Situation and Tale - from a well known Canadian Musician.

Hi everyone. Today I thought I'd share a video by J.P. Cormier. J.P. Cormier is a traveling musician from Canada and I've seen him in concert six times. Two of those times were with another musician by the name of Dave Gunning. You can catch a little of their music from a video on You Tube (Place: Celtic Colours International Festival. Song: Kate O’ The Gowrie. Arrangement: Dave Gunning and J.P. Cormier. Year: 2019).   

J.P. Cormier is a fantastic guitar player, and has admirable arrangements, songwriting skills, and does You Tube videos reviewing guitars, teaching various styles of playing, interviews and jam sessions with other musicians, and anything else he can think of. He's a highly acclaimed and well known musician in Canada. He is not as well-known in the USA, but frequently crosses the border to perform. 

Anyway, my husband, who also plays the guitar and is a multi-instrumentalist, likes to watch J.P.'s videos from time to time. And sometimes we watch them together. And was he surprised to come across a video from four years ago where J.P. Cormier discusses domestic violence and child abuse!

He had me sit down and watch it.  

So I thought I'd share that video with all of you too.

I appreciate J.P.'s candor and ability to talk about this subject without fear. I have a few comments following the video. 

See it here directly on You Tube:
"A Life in Music Ep. 69 - Showdown at the FU Corral"
or below:

Some of my comments:

People who commit domestic violence "often make themselves appear to be victimized by the partner they are actually abusing". - that quote and link is from Google AI. 

Victims of domestic violence can minimize the threat to themselves. - that link goes to DomesticShelters.org. 

Domestic violence victims can feel guilty for seeing their partner in jail. - that link also goes to DomesticShelters.org 

There are reasons why so few abusers change:

It is not very likely they will change - check this article from the National Abuse Hotline

Can Abusers Change? 5 Almost Impossible Obstacles Explained - by The Mend Project
- this article explains why:
* Perpetrators are in relationships to control the other person.  
* There is entitlement and double standards (i.e. "What's okay for me to do, isn't okay for you to do.")
* Family System bias (I usually call this "family prejudice", whether it be about choice of spouse, political leanings, weight, race, sex of person such as misogyny, disabilities, cultural leanings - usually there is something they've learned to be prejudiced about from their family of origin that is often multi-generational)
* Image control (undermining others to uphold status) - other articles refer to this as "efforts to achieve grandiosity at others' expense". 
* Low emotional IQ: "disinterest in others' emotions, resulting in controlling behaviors, lack of empathy, and defensiveness." - quote from the article. However, low emotional IQ can also be the result of brain chemistry in some perpetrators. 

My personal view on why narcissists tend not to change is all of these things, but I'll also add that when a person is mainly out to control others, dominate others and have power over others, they are not thinking about "how to treat others better", or "how to make up with others so that the relationship can grow and thrive", or even about "how to get along with others better". In other words, they are going after people and relationships for a totally different reason than the rest of us are. 

I also think part of the problem is that society is machine, utility, tool and toy oriented. We "use things" constantly to "make our lives easier and better". Somewhere in a budding abuser's brain, he or she got the idea that they can use people in the same way as they use a toy, a utility, a tool or a machine. If they see that it will work to a greater rather than lesser extent, they keep using people. 

People who use people to make their lives easier and better aren't looking at this "machine-person" or "toy-person", and trying to decipher its feelings. They are either thinking, "This toy or machine is working" or "not working". The person is either a useful toy or machine, or not a useful one.

They are either going to fix the toy-person or machine-person that works best for them, or in a way that "puts them back together the way they used to be." If they feel that the machine-person or toy-person will no longer work in the way they want it to again, or in the way that it used to, they have to make another choice. In fact, they are forced to make another choice.

And how do people treat toys and machines when they don't work the way want them to, or they used to, or are "supposed to"? Maybe they don't understand the mechanisms that make this toy or machine work or rebel. Someone who is rage-driven, control-driven and antagonistically driven as many perpetrators tend to be usually either gets mad at the machine or toy and stomps all over it, or throws it away in a fit of anger. And so: "Welcome to the world of domestic violence!" and for people in power who act like this, "Welcome to dictatorship!" too. 

Some questions/ruminations I have ... 

J.P. talks about pulling back from playing music performances with his wife (now ex), and playing with "guys" instead. "Pulling back" could have meant she was no longer making money, or that the music partnership was dissolving and that she didn't know what to do, or how to resolve it, or how to react, or what to do with her own music career. Maybe she couldn't think, and just found that her anger was building.

"Pulling back" might also mean, to some women, "fear of being abandoned, of marriage failure, of marriage dissolution, of marital money being only controlled by him, of marital harmony only controlled by him, of marital status only being controlled by him".

For someone who might be controlling, having the partner in control instead might have been interpreted as "deeply threatening", "deeply unnerving", "deeply provoking", or "of feeling threatened". Even if it is a "phantom threat", or a "possible threat", or a "threat of possibilities" of more withdrawal, an insecure person might lash out? Might turn a "phantom threat" into a "real threat" in her own mind?

Is it possible that this was the main impetus for "the scenes" in the room where he was sleeping? 

Granted, it's hard to figure out as he never really knew either. I'm making a few hypotheses based on what I know about "perpetrator behaviors", and the fact that these behaviors are often based on "control" of another person, or feeling "out of control" or "not controlling enough" when it comes to other people. 

Also, he was allegedly a victim of child abuse. And as a child, he learned to be afraid, and to walk away, as he saw that nothing was to be gained by violence, or sticking around to fight back. "Staying, getting mad, and fighting back can kill a person" because the body is fragile, and you can't be sure you are "saving someone" when you are fighting them at the same time, even in self defense.

He also says that guns and knives were pointed at him when he was a child. He admits in the video that his mind was filled with panic and fear, which was, perhaps, why his first instinct was to "get safe" by locking the door on his wife when she was trying to get back in the room. 

It sounds like his mind went wild, possibly envisioning guns and knives and other weapons pointed at him, similar to what he went through in childhood. 

Childhood memories and childhood trauma can have a big impact on how we react when we are adults - having guns and knives pointed at you, and being a victim of violence as a child, can impact the way you deal with scenes that might seem similar in adulthood. 

Anyway, those are some of my own thoughts on the matter ... 

Here are some more links:

Am I likely to be abused no matter what, i.e. be a victim of domestic violence again? Abuse escalates; it's very rare for it to de-escalate, whether that's physical abuse or emotional abuse or both. In other words, it tends increase in danger and in introduction to other types of abuses, not decrease.

Forgiving abusers is often not suggested (from Google AI):

Forgiving abusers is not required for healing and is often not suggested, as it can hinder recovery by enabling continued abuse, reducing necessary consequences for the abuser, and forcing premature closure. Trauma recovery focuses on the survivor’s safety and needs, making forgiveness a personal choice rather than a necessity, say Psychology Today. 

Key reasons why forgiving an abuser is often not recommended include:

* Risk of Further Abuse: Premature or forced forgiveness can lead to safety risks, enabling continued abuse.

* Lack of Accountability: Forgiving too quickly, especially without genuine repentance from the abuser, can remove necessary consequences for their actions.

* Hindering Healing: It may interrupt the necessary process of dealing with emotions like anger and grief, acting as a form of self-betrayal, notes YouTube.

* Not an Obligation: Survivors are not obligated to forgive to heal, and doing so should not be seen as a mandatory step in therapy.

The Truth About Forgiving Abuse With Valerie Hudson

Have you been told to forgive an emotionally abusive husband? Here's what you need to know. - by Betrayal Trauma Recovery Podcast

Going back to abusers and living in a cycle of constant reconciliations after abuse are often not suggested by therapists. 

Do a lot of adult children who have been abused or assalted during childhood end up being the victim of domestic violence or domestic abuse in adulthood? Yes. Abuse was normalized in the childhood home, so victims of child abuse tend to stay in relationships that are abusive in adulthood longer than most people do. 

Do a lot of adult children of child abuse end up in the arts? Yes. What the Google AI article reveals (partial):
Yes, research and anecdotal evidence suggest a significant link between childhood adversity—including abuse, neglect, and family dysfunction—and a higher likelihood of individuals pursuing careers in the arts. Studies indicate that traumatic childhoods can drive individuals to channel their pain into intense creativity, using art as a vehicle for emotional expression, recovery, and control.

What is Battered Wife Syndrome? (however this can manifest in men too). 

Anyway, I feel bad about what happened to him. It doesn't surprise me that he turned to the guitar and to performing considering all of what he endured. There are things in life that relieve trauma better than others, and the rhythms, modes of practice and time alone have something in common with trauma therapies. Even the most common therapy, EMDR, has a very rhythmic element to it. I think this is why, in part, people who have gone through abuse turn to arts professions. Some of it also has to do with acceptance based on competence, and even "perfectionism". And some of it has to do with social elements like being part of a tribe of other people in the arts. 

I find a lot of former victims are "nature bugs" too: hikers, photographers of nature, animal caretakers, people who enjoy being outdoors more than indoors, world or country travelers, traveling salesmen, farmers who enjoy farming the old way with horses, people who work in wildlife professions, etc. Again, there are elements of this that may have some resemblence to trauma therapy too. 

At some point I will share some of my findings about this phenomenon. I'm probably not going to be able to bring up individual names, but there is no harm in bringing up the subject in ways that may be really helpful to others. 

Thank you, J.P. for being so open. May it help others. 

Why Do Narcissists Take the Vindictive Path When People Aren't Doing What They Want? Do Narcissists Get Satisfaction For Revenge, Vindictiveness, and Retaliations?

So are narcissists vengeful, and do they get satisfaction from being that way? 

The most simplistic answer is Yes, narcissists can get satisfaction from revenge from a Google AI article I found (and taken from a number of psychology articles).

The gist of the discussion in that article (or answer) is that narcissists can't handle differences they have with other people, and look at those differences as an attack. They are unable to feel good if there are disagreements or differences of opinion with another person, especially if they are unable to sway or control the opinions, thoughts or experiences of others. Narcissists can't accept others as separate human beings who are not out to serve them and what they want at all times, or out to get their self esteem stroked by the narcissist. Most people are independent thinkers, in other words, and accept that there will be different opinions and thought processes from one person to the next.
     Most people, except the most brainwashed among us, are not out to accept the narcissist's way of thinking and opinions on all matters as our own.
     Malignant narcissists feel they are losing control of others (and power, control and domination is what is most important to them in all relationships), and that it is an afront to their arrogance and delusions of superiority. 
     In order to reject the opinions, thought processes, and experiences of others, they reason they have to reject the person. Malignant narcissists go further than that and feel they have to punish the person, and this is where vindictive narcissism comes in. 
     Narcissists cannot handle this common and normal way of relating (i.e. disagreeing, having different opinions, having ambitions separate from pleasing them, having different thought processes, having different experiences than a narcissist thinks they are having, and they see all of it as a personal attack on them and their delusional superiority and respond in a vindictive, vengeful manner).

This is a problem for the rest of us, obviously. 

Better articles on vindictive narcissism are these two articles:

Vindictive Narcissists: 10 Signs & How to Handle One - by Hailey Shafir, LCMHCS, LPCS, LCAS, CCS and medically reviewed by Rajy Abulhosn, MD for Choosing Therapy

What is Vindictive Narcissism? - by Simone Marie and Sandra Silva, and medically reviewed by Karin Gepp, PsyD

The articles say the same things, except in a more lengthy way, and also tell you how to deal with vindictive narcissism (protect yourself, find a way to back out of the relationship, put up strong boundaries). 

Since narcissists have trouble regulating their emotions, and vindictiveness is the first thing they feel, and what they want to act on, they go into it headlong, and at first it is impulsively driven. This is why they are more likely to be dangerous just before you leave the relationship with them, or just after, or when you are resisting their punishments or power and control agendas. Revenge can quickly take over their mental and emotional state and even their entire life in some cases, where they become absolutely obsessed until and unless their plans of certain punishments become a reality. 

Even if the other person caves or apologizes for upsetting the narcissist, the narcissist's lack of empathy and suspicious nature will mean that they will not necessarily accept the different qualities others have from them, and can find it impossible to forgive the other person, whereby the vindictiveness permanently remains and never quite satisfies the narcissist. In these cases, revenge becomes on-going. 

Some things I have come across via the internet are survivors of child abuse who left their family of origin to get married. They were part of a cult-like narcissistic family system where they were either deemed "for" the family in the way of being always present and always submissive to what their parents wanted in terms of providing for the family and being present in all family affairs, or "totally against" the family if they sought their own way of life in another part of the country, or overseas, or via getting married to start their own family. 

Sometimes things happen, like their spouse dies, or there is a divorce. The family invites the member back with open, seemingly loving arms, and then the family destroys all property, including pictures and memorabilia of their time away from the family without the permission of that returned family member. It is done to wipe out their past. In some cases that caused that member to leave again (the more common outcome), or conversely to feel trapped with nowhere to go. Some of the trapped members had suicidal thoughts. 

Many of these families believe that hurting a member in this way will teach that member never to leave again and to go along with constant commands and demands of the authoritarians in the family, but it simply does not work and here is why. This has some bearing on whether narcissists, over the long term, get satisfaction out of revenge, or if it is just another "it's never enough" thought process (a common stuck obsession about all kinds of issues around domination and control agendas that narcissists are famous for, and feeling they don't get enough of). 

Another situation comes from a domestic violence group I belong to where seeing young women with bloody lips, black and blue eyes, and their faces smashed up while they are sitting in a hospital bed is a somewhat common occurrence. In a lot of these cases, these women never saw this kind of violence coming, even though they knew they were being watched constantly, controlled to the point of the ridiculous, and emotionally abused. They were trying to figure out how to deal with the rages and emotional abuse of their men in our group, ways to calm the situations they were in, and did not think, in their wildest dreams, that they would be hit. Some of them had warning signs like their possessions being destroyed, or the man was putting his fist through a wall, or stalking, but almost all of them did not think that would ever translate into violence against them.

The thing is, abuse escalates, and with enough emotional abuse, it can tip over into physical abuse (I find this the case particularly if a woman has PTSD and is disassociating: going blank, freezing, an involuntary response). It's unfortunate that it escalates so fast after the man finds that emotional abuse isn't hurtful, threatening or scary enough.

Even subtle signs like being pushed or led in a demanding, controlling manner often precludes getting hit. 

Anyway, many of these stories entail a man beating his woman as a way to get her to submit to what he wants. In some of these instances what he wants is a total fantasy, such as his woman confessing to an affair she has not had, or to an attraction to a man she barely noticed, or does not know. She is being beaten for being disloyal when she hasn't been disloyal. What a lot of these men don't understand is that it is virtually impossible to be disloyal when these women are isolated in such extreme ways, and when their victim is spending most of her time trying to calm his rages and reassure him, and when he attempts to make his micro-managements of her the center of her attention all of the time. 

Hitting her is supposed to keep her from being disloyal, but most often it creates a situation where she wants to get away, and yes, be disloyal even if just to speak out about what has been done to her, or to live without him in her life. Hospital workers will also be helping her have that agenda and teaching her about how abuse escalates - and this includes "no matter how she acts, and no matter which of her soothing techniques she decides is most effective." None of them are effective when it comes to physical abuse.  

One reason narcissistic jealous and suspicious boyfriends, lovers, and husbands suspect their women of cheating is often because of projection. Most narcissists cheat (around 75 percent of them). And if they aren't cheating, they usually have some other clandestine activity they are pursuing whether it is getting drugs for a drug addiction, or a gambling addiction, or a porn addiction, or a peep show addiction, or other kind of activity where secrets are kept. 

The suspicions can also be a result of growing up in an environment of people who were hostile and exploitative. They might have been spared that treatment themselves, but they saw it being done to others. Lack of loyalty is triggering to them as many of them take it to mean hostility and exploitation, producing rage as the outlet, and for narcissists with malignant characteristics, violence. They tell themselves they will not be abandoned, or exploited, or treated as though their voice doesn't have any bearing, even when they've adopted all of those qualities themselves. They get around to believing that threats and being menacing is the only way to prevent it happening to them. 

They conduct themselves in relationships as though everything is a threat to them and their fragile egos. 

But who wants to be around someone who is hurting you all of the time anyway, even if they are using it as an insurance policy against being fooled, cheated on, and exploited, and who is a danger to your life? And domestic violence is always dangerous to your life - violence has a way of getting out of control, particularly if the other person is trying to protect themselves from blows - more likely than not as the body does what it does to protect itself; it is why when you fall your arms go out first, automatically, to cushion the fall and to keep your face and head protected.

The same goes to protecting your face and head from being hit: your arms and hands will automatically act as a shield to protect you from the blows. 

Invariably most of these men were always begging their woman to come back after she was released from the hospital. If she refused, the stalking alternated between "sick love puppy who cannot live without her" to threatening, destructive and sometimes violent, or criminal, reactions, in other words, the perpetrators had a very pronounced Jekyll/Hyde manifestation (called "splitting" - and in extreme ways).  

For those women who go back, they find that their loyalty is deemed to never be enough by their man. These women find themselves constantly insulted (where they are told they never do enough for the man, they aren't pretty enough, they aren't smart enough, they aren't sane enough, they are nasty and not nice, that they are worthless and useless, and so on). As I said, "never-enough-ness" is a dominant narcissistic trait, as are fantasies about what another person is feeling, thinking and experiencing. And to make matters even more scary, they tend to think they can read other people's minds (where arrogance and feeling they are superior to everyone else comes into play, another delusion you have to deal with as they can be insistent that you are feeling and thinking things you are not feeling and thinking). 

There is also always a tone of disrespect too, as though you are too unable to make autonomous decisions, or too disabled to do anything or say anything other than to follow their orders. You are required to either parentify them, or infantilize them (and you never know which one they want at any given time, which can bring on more violence: "Who do you take me to be? A child that constantly needs to be reassured!?" and "Who do you take me to be? Your parent who has to tell you what to do all of the time?!" - it's positively crazy-making, but so common). 

It is where co-dependency and trauma bonding start and never end as long as you stay in a relationship with a narcissist. 

And by the way, if domestic violence is going on where one partner is initiating hitting his (or her) other partner, it's usually a sign of malignant narcissism. In child abuse cases where there is physical abuse and harm, as well as punishments that are essentially about neglect and rejection of a child, these cases are perpetrated by malignant narcissists too. Malignant narcissists generally never get better, and often get so much worse, and because of the antisocial personality disorder mixed in with the narcissism, they are dangerous enough to seek protection and boundaries from, or get away from altogether (where going to a domestic abuse center can help you plan an un-violent escape).

You also cannot talk a malignant narcissist out of their delusionary judgements about what you really feel and think, and who you are. They are too suspicious and adamant that they know how to read your mind, and the reading is always going to entail how you are their enemy, even if it is just one time you did not agree with them, or do what they wanted. They simply can't trust you again, and they will want to retaliate against you at some time or other, whether a lot or a little. How they retaliate is often dependent on how enraged they are. Which is why you have to be careful of the hoover (the hoover is about sweet-talking you back into the relationship with them). 

Another way to tell if you are dealing with a malignant narcissist where you are trying to put up boundaries, or separate from them, they won't just be running smear campaigns, which all narcissists do. They will also be indulging in some kind of crime too, or at the very least breaking or giving away property that is yours, or things you have given them.

If they have any covert narcissistic qualities, they will be trying to convince everyone they know that they are the victim. They can even say they were a victim of infidelity even when they dreamt it up - very common and very nauseating. 

I think it should be obvious why you can't really have any kind of meaningful relationship or discourse with a malignant narcissist. It will always be threatening, and always be about the narcissist hurting you, trying to get more submission out of you, and getting off on your pain. It is also very likely that they are fooling other people into believing their fake victim stories and getting duper's delight from them.  

As the article from the link suggests, duper's delight actually has an addictive quality to it, and the person delighting in duping others most often ends up lying just about anything and everything. It tends to create a full time liar or exaggerator of the truth, and who can be really pleased, at peace with themselves, and truly happy being a full time liar? The feelings of alienation, being alone, and trying not to get caught, would be negatives most people aren't willing to gamble on in their own relationships. It's permanently isolating and extremely shameful.

In contrast, it's nothing like the fulfillment empaths have living in the truth and sharing their inner-most thoughts and feelings with one another, and real trust, not the fake kind of trust narcissists try to promote about themselves. 

Given the choice between lying to others all of the time and getting duper's delight from fooling others, versus experiencing a really trusting relationship with a lot of sharing, full time trust, and a lot of co-operation, which would you prefer?

And it is a preference. Malignant narcissists prefer duper's delight because most of them trust no one. It's why the covert malignant narcissists who are most likely to go after duper's delight in their relationships, never share much of anything in their relationships. It says so much about them and how untrustworthy they are themselves, and it certainly says a lot about their total lack of ethics. 

I think most of us can see that they miss out on a lot of meaning, life, truth, fulfillment and even those feelings of "having enough" by going down that road. 

And once the "mask falls" and they get caught with so many lies, and getting off on the pain of others, it's more than a little disgusting. All of the shame they've been running away from in their relationships starts up again, and they are even faced with self-shame. Most people who uncover an ugly truth like duper's delight will want no part in any kind of real relationship with the narcissist again. 

So, none of this ends up in a good place, whether you are the narcissist, or the victim, although victims are better equipped at finding good relationships than narcissists will ever experience. 

SO DO NARCISSISTS GET SATISFACTION FOR REVENGE,
VINDICTIVENESS, AND RETALIATIONS? 

It's pretty clear they do, otherwise they wouldn't keep doing it. But like duper's delight, it's never going to be fulfilling over the long term because who wants to be around a narcissist who wants to hurt you just because you didn't follow an order, or agree with them, or because you have a different opinion that can't be swayed by them? Who wants an ongoing relationship with a narcissist who only wants submission from other people? Who wants an ongoing relationship with a narcissist who wants constant revenge on you or someone else, and who gets a kind of junky attention from it, and who rationalizes the necessity of revenges to make themselves feel almighty and powerful? 

Like duper's delight, most people will be disgusted by it, will find it to be evil. 

It gets more people running away from them than towards them, certainly. No one really likes being in relationships where the other person doesn't have any empathy, or ethics, gets off on lying, gets off on plans of retaliations and crimes that show their selfishness in bright details, entitlements, hoovers, tricking others, and boorishly tries to take advantage of others.  

It puts most of us on edge because it's a threat to our well-being.  

It's been said many times that relationships with narcissists traumatize most of us. If two narcissists are in a relationship together, the narcissist that is closer to the malignant brand of narcissism or psychopathy can traumatize the narcissist with less psychopathy. So one way or another, there is trauma to go around. 

I was watching Richard Grannon's channel once, and he said he had clients that were lamenting: "The narcissist always comes out on top!" And Richard said he never knew of a single narcissist who came out on top. They eventually all become disappointed wrecks of human beings. 

We only need to turn to well known malignant narcissists to see how they fared. Hitler ended up poisoning himself as troops surrounded his bunker. Mussolini was executed. Napoleon was banished. King Henry the Eighth died at the age of 55 and any number of his ailments could have caused his demise from an infected leg wound that never healed and possibly was septic (it was infected for eleven years), to gout and possibly a pulmonary embolism. His body was severely obese to the point where he could no longer walk, and he left a country in financial crisis.

And how is Putin doing with his invasion plans?

None of these men felt or feel their dreams had been fulfilled by the end of their life, or had a sense of a life well lived. 

A lot of it is caused by the "never-enough-ness" grumblings that plague most narcissists. They didn't get enough power and control over people; people weren't submissive enough for them; people weren't loyal enough for them; people weren't nice enough to them (and some of them were even "nasty", something that perpetrators repeatedly call women who disappoint them); they didn't hurt so-and-so enough; they weren't catapulted into positions of power enough, people weren't bright enough to not realize they were geniuses; people weren't trusting of them enough to let them take over; people never praised them enough; people weren't grateful enough for all the things they did do and were too focused on what they didn't do; people couldn't see they were superior to everyone else because they were not self effacing enough; no relationship was good enough for them; their children didn't become anything special enough for them; their spouse didn't make enough money or wasn't generous enough to them; their children and spouses weren't smart or successful enough for them; their lovers never appreciated them enough; their children were never "good enough" children; no one could ever read their mind in a  good enough way and certainly not as good as they could read others' minds (this is, of course, a delusion);  no one ever saw enough of the brilliant talent they had; and home health care workers never did enough for them when they become old. 

All of this leads them to be hyper critical of others, demanding, commanding and never satisfied. They especially try to instill the thought into their children that these children are not enough as people. What this really translates into is that children are not pleasing and submissive enough for a narcissist; they aren't endowed with enough narcissistic supply for a narcissist; they aren't making their parenting look good enough for their narcissistic parent; their children aren't easy enough not to go ballistic on, i.e. go into rages and punishments all of the time; their children aren't praising them enough; their children aren't doing what they are told enough; their children seem more ugly than other children, that they aren't beautiful enough to admire. Children who are too heavily dominated by the narcissistic parent (without their other parent pushing back on their ambition to destroy a child's self esteem) can carry the burden that they are not enough their whole entire lives.

They can especially get the sense that they don't work hard enough, where one of the traits of being a scapegoat is that they become work-a-holics.  

Dr. Ramani Durvasula and Jerry Wise often talk at length in their writings and videos about how narcissists crush their children's self esteem, and that only being a puppet with no boundaries is the only way they will ever receive affection, or be seen, or respected by their narcissistic parent ... until the next round of devaluation and narcissistic exaggerated disappointments which turn into shaming the child (and for malignant narcissists violence or punishments meant to hurt). The child takes in that they are "not enough" and the destruction to his self esteem, his budding personality, his ambitions and accomplishments therefor aren't enough (and if his parent is violent towards their child, physical destruction of the child too).  

If an adult child shows that they are internally endowed with self esteem which can come from being away from the narcissist for a length of time, or pursuing an interest or education away from the family system, the narcissist can double down on terrorizing. No narcissist can deal with, or stand, any child of theirs with self esteem, including enough intelligence to know why their parent is trying to wreck their self esteem.

All of it creates endless amounts of emotional dysregulation and rage in the parent, and for malignant narcissists, revenge and retaliation too. 

And the reason why narcissists are rarely satisfied with their own children is because relationship satisfaction does not come from trying to get power, control and domination over others, and traumatizing them. Which begs the question: Maybe they are not enlightened enough to realize that? 

I doubt that most narcissists are even aware that most people who have any significant relationship with them experience trauma. If they knew the people in their lives experienced enough trauma, maybe they would stop, but they don't. 

I think most people know these days that trauma responses aren't healthy. The fawn, fight, freeze, flee trauma responses aren't healthy for the people who are experiencing them. If these trauma responses are further stuffed ("I'm going to pretend these situations never happened, and I'm going to live my life as though this and that never hurt me"), it's likely to be stored in the body and manifest as disease. It's been well documented that spousal abuse and particularly child abuse, and having a parent or spouse with Narcissistic Personality Disorder often means a compromised immunity and often a clipped longevity. 

Trauma causes stress - lots of it, and you only have to look to people who go through a car accident or rape to know how long lasting the effects are. Stuffed stress causes disease. And there is also evidence that has surfaced that when narcissists try to make situations and people stressed, they let go of their own stress while giving it to someone else. 

In my readings and research, I came across this class offering: How to Identify and Address the Survival Responses That Perpetuate Suffering and Block Therapy for NICABM (National Institute for the Clinical Application of Behavioral Medicine)

excerpt:
     Develop a more targeted and nuanced approach to treating trauma

woman trapped in childhood trauma. There’s been a breakthrough in the way we treat trauma.
     For years, clients have presented with defensive adaptations to trauma that don’t fit within the fight-flight-freeze model you learned in grad school.
     And without the tools to identify and address these (often subtle) adaptations, many clients were left stuck, stagnant, and suffering.
     But recently, the top minds in our field have developed strategies to help us take a more targeted and nuanced approach with these “emerging” trauma responses . . .
     . . . and become more effective in our ability to help clients overcome unresolved trauma.

Those other trauma responses are:
* Attach/Cry for Help
* Collapse and Submit
* Please and Appease

All of these trauma responses are either going to mean dissociation, separation from the narcissist emotionally, or psychologically, or physically, and possibly through something I thought up, a Lie and Appease response (which is really just another version of the Please and Appease trauma response, but with added lies to keep the narcissist pleased even if internally you are not agreeing with everything they want, everything they demand, and everything they say - in other words you are pretending to go along until you can find a way to escape obligation). 

The reason why it would be traumatic is because lying brings with it some fear of being caught, and a lot of fear can cause anxiety, but most of all, stress.

Again, nothing is going to free you of stress in a relationship with a narcissist. 

Most of us bend towards healthy relationships, empathetic people, ethical people, people we can trust, people who are ultra-mature, and narcissists do not provide any of this. Again, if they aren't ripping you apart to your face (the general way they do this), then they are ripping you apart behind your back. It's going to be one or the other.

They can't be pleased and most of them make that known to you whether in the many criticisms and disrespectful comments they dole out, or subtly by not listening to what you have to say, being distracted when you talk, or looking bothered by your presence. It's not a happy place to be, and even for a lot of us, it's not a good enough relationship because we can't really say we trust them, or that we are happy with their level of empathy, or that we feel healthy, alive, appreciated, fulfilled and joyful in their presence and in relating to them. The never-enough-ness begins to mirror theirs and we waste years of our lives waiting for trustworthiness that doesn't exist in them, empathy that does not exist in them, being heard in an understanding "got it" kind of way that does not exist in them, appreciation for who we are which does not exist in them, feeling and being healthy in the relationship which does not exist because on-going trauma is not a space where good health can preside. 

Finding others who can match our level of empathy and respect can get rid of the never-enough-ness in us.

It won't for the narcissist (because finding others who match their empathy, and respect means relating to another never-enough-ness highly critical narcissist, and the whole "match" will seem like a whole lot of misunderstandings, arguments, duo rages, and no one willing to submit). 

FURTHER READING

Narcissistic Rage: Signs, Triggers, & How to Respond - by Nakpangi Thomas, PhD, LPC, TITC-CT, and medically reviewed by Dena Westphalen, Pharm.D 

Yes, people with narcissistic personality traits often feel like there is never enough - Google AI

Never Enough: The Narcissist’s Insatiable Curse - by Connolly Counselling Centre

I'm Never Enough for the Narcissist! - by Emily Mayfield for Mindset Therapy

7 Ways Narcissists Make You Feel Inferior - by Darius Cikanavicius for Psych Central

A vindictive narcissist is someone with narcissistic traits or NPD who is often cruel, callous, and mean towards others - Google AI

How Do You Say Goodbye to an Abusive Family Member? - by Frøydis Fossli Moe for The New York Times

Why Do Some People With Narcissistic Personality Act in Vindictive Ways? - by Simone Marie and Sandra Silva, and medically reviewed by Karin Gepp, PsyD for Psych Central

10 Signs of Vindictive Narcissism: Know When to Act - by Judge Anthony for the Judge Anthony website

Hidden Narcissist (Sometimes, the narcissist in your life is pretty well-hidden) - by Peg Streep and reviewed by Matt Huston for Psychology Today

What Drives The Vindictive Narcissist? - video by psychologist, Les Carter, for You Tube

How do you PROTECT yourself from the narcissists VINDICTIVENESS? - by Dr. Ramani Durvasula for You Tube

What Revenge Tactics You Can Expect from a Narcissist - by the editorial staff of Marriage.com and reviewed by  Maggie Martinez, LCSW 

Will a Narcissist Try to Get Revenge? - by Elijah Akin for Unfilteredd

PART I: Some of How Trauma Bonds Are Formed with Narcissists

© Lise Winne
"Trauma Bond with False Narrative Blaming Cycle of Abuse" (all rights reserved)

In this post I discuss how trauma bonds can happen, and what is at stake for the recipient of the trauma bond. 

First of all, in trauma bonds there are always going be stark power differentials, where the person who holds the most power will want to take away from the person with less power. For narcissists, that usually means they want to take away the autonomous decisions, self esteem, and sense of peace from the person they deem as less powerful, so that they can gain more and more power over that individual for themselves. 

Ruminating that a less powerful individual that they've been taking power away from, even the power to take away autonomous decisions from that individual, will usually cause them to rage at, possibly reject, and resent that individual. 

Most trauma bonds in close personal relationships are between a parent and dependent child, between a parent and a disabled adult child, in a marriage where one partner lords power over their partner, and between siblings where one sibling (most often a favorite golden child who is financially and lovingly rewarded by parental figures) tries to control, damage and take something from another sibling (most often a scapegoat child who is financially punished by parental figures and where their love has been  withdrawn).

For the purposes of this post, I will be talking about situations between two adult partners in an intimate relationship, and mention more briefly the kind of trauma bond that is often formed between a parent and child. 

Since this is part of a series, I will be mentioning other kinds of trauma bonds eventually as they can occur between a boss and a worker, between an invader and the invaded, between soldiers and their captives, between a cult leader and their followers, between a president or national leader and the population, between a more powerful nation and a less powerful nation, between a drug dealer and addict, between a pimp and his prostitutes, between a perpetrator of child sexual abuse and his victim, and so on. A lot of these relationships can have violence and threats in them to make victims submit and to be more and more submissive.

On-going trauma bonds, particularly for children where the trauma bond is being instigated by a parent can be life long and can have a lot of adverse and devastating effects not only for the child, but for the parent, family, and for society will be discussed much later. Since trauma-bonding can effect the brain, brain development, and even what trauma survivors focus on (i.e. how to relate to perpetrators) it will also ultimately effect the evolution of the human species too. As a species, are we going to spend our time focusing on science, the health of a beautiful planet, the health of other people so that their attentions will be on the greater pursuits of human beings, the ability to make great, great works of art, architecture, beautiful cities, healthy joyful relationship building, or are we going to spend most of our time on the planet attacking and defending?

IN ADULT RELATIONSHIPS
(PARTICULARLY BETWEEN MARRIAGE PARTNERS AND INTIMATE PARTNERS)

To start off, I'm going to introduce you to a common way that power-hungry people (namely narcissists) decide to traumatize you and then intermittently award you for putting up with their rages. And I found a perfect example in a You Tube video by Dr. Ramani Durvasula called When narcissists HARM YOU and then expect a HUG... . I will expound on her video in this post so that you can see where this leads, and why, so often the narcissist abandons a person who is not falling in line with being controlled, some of the science as to why it doesn't work very well for them in any long term way even with an extreme power differential, and why the trauma bonded can also abandon the narcissist too. 

Following is some of what she said in that video (in blue type) to explain what can create a trauma bond. The "push-pull" reaction, and why the "Jekyll/Hyde" behavior that is on display here by the narcissist is what will create trauma in the other person.

I decided to write her words out, so that you can study them, and understand what is going on between both parties. 

     Trauma bonds are created by the alternation of bad and good, a good day and a bad day, idealization and devaluation. Sometime back in my podcast, the actress and writer Rebecca Humphries - she said it the most beautifully when she said in the narcissistic relationship she was in, it was like being pushed off a 100 story building and then the narcissist manages to be the one catch you just as you are about to hit the ground. So they are not just your abuser, they also become your savior.

And that is how trauma bonds get created and reinforced. ...
     Often in toxic relationships, they devalue, they demean, they insult, they argue, and once they feel better (it's like they let it all out), then they go in for the hug.
     Let's say it's a situation where they can't find their keys, and they believe that you've moved them. They say, "Hey, where are my keys!? Seriously, where are my keys!?"
     You may respond, "I don't know. I haven't seen them today."
     They say, "Yes! Yes you have seen my keys! You had to have seen my keys! I came home and I put them here, and you always move my stuff! You are so damned disorganized! Look at this mess! You don't put stuff away! I'm so sick of it! You have ruined my day! I need to go out in ten minutes to pick up that stuff and if I don't do it, then my entire day is going to be messed up! How could you do this to me!? How could you mess with my keys!?"
     Now imagine they are saying this relatively loudly like I was trying to show, and you really, really did not touch their keys. Some of you may go and try to look for the keys. Others of you may be having a freeze response where you're just sort of stuck. Some of you may fight back, but most of you will not feel well at this point. There will be more yelling. They are still trying to find them, then they say, "To hell with it! I am taking your car! Too bad if you need it!" And they grab their coat and put it on and viola: their car keys are in their pocket.
     They feel that pocket and they feel that jingle and they say, "Got 'em!" and then "I'm heading out!" and no apology. But as they are about to head out (and this is the part that's not okay), they may come in for a hug.
     They'll say, "Oh, come on! Let's make up!" and they'll come in for the hug or the kiss, and you mean well at this point, but you may feel sick, exhausted, depleted, scared, or triggered, but they may want to have a snuggle or a kiss and where "Let's make up!" makes no sense because they were the ones who were screaming at you for something you didn't do. It was largely a one-sided argument (if you want to call it an argument because there was no other side to it) ...
     ... If you freeze up and don't respond, they are going to tell you that you are difficult and unforgiving. But at a somatic level, to have the person who just psychologically harmed you, and then tried to touch you in a soothing or intimate manner (for lack of a better way to say it), it's kind of gross. And once again, you may feel that there is no response you're allowed to have - because if you push back or don't respond to them - it all starts again.
     It's always important to remember that narcissistic folks always use conflict to regulate. The yelling and screaming and abuse allow them to reassert their power, and as they shatter you, they feel better. So after they feel better (and that coupled with their lack of empathy), then as far as they're concerned, everything's fine. And they come in for the hug, and they just assume you want to snuggle because your argument is done. And they play upon your self-blame and your self doubt because when you push back and say, "I'm not hugging you!" and "We're going to have to talk about this more" and just say "This doesn't feel okay", then you become the bad person who can't let go of stuff.
     It feels very violating when someone swoops in for a hug or a snuggle, or a kiss after they have harmed you, and there has not been a period of time for you to talk it out, or work it through. Everything is on their time frame. And the more that happens, the worse it feels. Things that happen in the relationship feel like they are happening to you, and not with you. You are relegated to being an object, a sort of adult pacifier that they use to regulate, and when they are done with the yelling, they will want to regulate by being held. It's really not much different than a tantrum-ing toddler that screams and cries, and starts yelling in the middle of a store, and then they need a hug from the parent afterwards. But there's a big difference. That toddler is three, not fifty three. But many people are confused, and really put off ... It definitely reinforces, as you can imagine, the trauma bond. And it can also reinforce that somehow "You're the one who is closed off, you're the one who is mean. You're the one who is cold or unforgiving" if you don't just go with it. It's not true, but it is an absolute Catch-22 because there is no way you can talk to them about it and share your feelings. And then there is the stuck-ness, and that tees up the self blame.
     ... When someone goes from rage to affection, it's very normal not to want to hug back ... it's not about you holding back, or being distant, or holding a grudge, it's that other person not having empathy, or absolutely no awareness, of how their behavior is effecting you. So if that dynamic happens, be aware. It is quite harmful, and it reinforces a trauma bond.
     And when they constantly put themselves in this position of tyrant and tormenter, and lover and hugger and care-er, of perpetrator and savior, there's really no winning at that game, and it really helps you to understand why this relationship is not only so difficult to remain sort of sane in, but even more difficult ... to get out of. 

What Dr. Ramani doesn't fully explain in her video (although she does explain it in many of her other videos) is that while the trauma bond is building, the person on the receiving end of the rages and hugs is usually responding with these trauma reactions: fawn, fight, flight, freeze, or avoid. 

To a narcissist, these trauma reactions are narcissistic supply and they may very well be thinking these things (*trigger warning*):

Fawning: "You're going to fawn!? Good! That's what I want, for you to do everything I want, when I want it, and I'll correct how you're responding! Please me now! I'll guide the way on how you can please me!"

Fighting back: "You're fighting!? How dare you fight me! We'll just see who wins this fight! I'll win it, that's who! I'm superior and I'll knock you down a peg or two, and punish you! If you defend yourself, then that is your way of fighting with me too. I don't respect your defenses and explanations. I'll find a way to make you feel guilty and pay whether I'm the one who lost the keys or not! You are not to mess with my rages and perceptions! Got that!?"

Freezing: "You're just going to sit there in your frozen state! You're supposed to be reacting, or at least looking for my goddam keys! What's the matter with you!? Are you crazy or something!? This is important! This is what I hate about you! You're totally useless at a time like this! You're supposed to be looking for my keys! Anyone else would be looking for my keys! But not you! You're so incompetent. In fact, you're crazy! "

Fleeing (flight): "You're going to just walk away! You have better things to do than look for my keys which you moved on purpose!? I see that I'm high on your priority list! Always running away when there are important issues in this house! For all I'm getting around here, it's no wonder I'm not having an affair! You owe it to me not to escape and to help me find the keys that you actually moved! Maybe you moved them on purpose just to get me into that state! Did you do it!?" 

Avoid: "You weren't home when the keys went missing! What are you trying to do!? Avoid me!? Because if you are, I'm going to catch up with you! I never put those keys in my pocket, goddam it! You did it! I had to spend hours looking for them too! It's your fault, and as soon as you realize it, the better!" 

Some of this may not be said outright, but they are inferred. 

The partner of the narcissist is going to be undergoing situations that resemble the keys situation over, and over, and over, and over again. It won't just be about keys, obviously. It may, in fact take over every conversation depending on how controlling they are.

If they are true run-of-the-mill narcissists, they'll be telling you what you did, or thought, or felt, and they will be enraged about it. If you disagree with them, they'll be invalidating your disagreements because it doesn't fit in with their blaming narrative, and what they perceive as "the truth". I talk about why they do this below (it has to do with a number of traits that are particular to narcissists, and why, even when they are caught, can't readily admit why they screwed up. For the meantime I'll say it is a compulsion: they feel they need to blame and rage, even if they might not be in touch with reality, or what it is doing to the other person). 

Anyway, the same sort of situations will play out again and again that resemble "the keys" diatribe. It might happen when you forget to pick up the clothes at the dry cleaners. It might be about not putting enough gas in the car. It might be about not setting the table to the narcissist's exacting standards. It might be about why you weren't thanking them enough when they got you to the hospital after getting the car in an accident where you were the passenger. It might be about how you caused the accident because they told you they were tired, and you should have been the one to drive. It might be about how you didn't ask for forgiveness when they were giving you the silent treatment. It might be because they wanted to leave you the message that you were no longer allowed to talk to them about anything. 

The silent treatment is hard to figure out, and the reasons why narcissists use it are often indecipherable and muddy for a reason, but you can bet you aren't going to know the real reason, and you will surely fail at doing what they want when they go silent on you, so they refuse to discuss anything at all with you. If you do attempt to get to the bottom of it, you'll most likely get a similar kind of confusing blaming and rage session as the "keys incident", only much, much worse. 

Most narcissists don't communicate directly, but leave interpretations open-ended so that if you accuse them of the silent treatment, they can blame you for not really understanding what was really going on. It's a dirty mind game, of course, but this is a common narcissistic tactic that you should always be aware of. 

They may even do this cycle of erroneous blaming, then attacking (insults, yelling, threats) in about every situation in your joint relationship after awhile, and over every action and reaction you make, in a kind of micro-managing style as in the movie, Sleeping with the Enemy. The cycle is very common, even with the hug at the end, but I would bet that eventually you won't even get that, that the only reactions you'll get over time are the crazy blaming and rages. Most of your relationship, for them, will be about how you respond to the blinding rages, whether you respond, what you do when you respond, while they are blaming you for the next thing you didn't do. 

Or let us say that there are some situations where they are half-right, but they are not listening to the context or situation that it happened in, and they go on raging at you about what they believe really happened, and they still won't let you explain or defend yourself, or tell them what the situation is because they are on to the next false accusations ... 

They decide what you are doing, thinking, feeling, planning, and you're supposed to go along with what they believe, and respond to it all in such a way that they want, to show themselves that they still have control over you and how you react. As Dr. Ramani said in her video, they become addicted to treating you this way to get themselves emotionally regulated, feeling at peace within themselves and the relationship, and in charge, but it is all at your expense.

As the relationship progresses, the false accusations build up. Their suspicions (paranoia) build up at the same time about what you are possibly doing, what you are possibly thinking, and what you are possibly feeling - and whether you'll think of bucking their control over you, or whether you will hurt them, or run off on them when they start to rage for the 1,658th time in your relationship with them. Usually by the time they become really paranoid of your intentions (which is why there are false narratives to begin with, in part), many of them can't live with the paranoia or any reaction that isn't what they have come to expect, so they often end relationships at this point, suddenly, without explanation. They reason with themselves that they need someone ultra predictable, weak and timid, who can be groomed to be a better sycophant. 

The problem with abrupt endings to relationships, especially when you aren't getting anything but muddled confusing narratives, reasons and messages, is that there are usually matters to settle between you, even if it is just going to be about retrieving some of your clothes, or asking if they are going to be at a party you both were invited to (going to a party where the two of you are separated is difficult to deal with just after a break-up, and it's reasonable to ask your ex-partner if they will be there). 

But there, again, they are going to be raging at you over something, perhaps for accepting their rejection (and not working hard for their approval), or they'll be raging at you because: "I made it clear I don't want to talk to you! And I could care less whether you will be at that party or not! There's plenty of fish in the sea and I'll just ignore you! So there!" Or if it's about your clothes: "You're worried about your clothes at a time like this! I could care less about that pink cocktail dress you always thought you looked great in! It belongs in the dumpster and that's where I'm putting it! You must be crazy to want that back! I hate the color pink! But you were always too blind to see it! You are too blind to see anything that I like and don't like, apparently!"

Any response they have will be unpleasant to deal with.

These arguments (or actually diatribes) are most often no-win situations. Relationships with narcissists don't end the way most relationships do, with a lot of discussion beforehand, especially about compromises you could both make to solve a problem. In most relationships, the problem is the issue between you, but with narcissists, the problem is almost always going to be about what they believe about you, or what they think or falsely want to present to themselves and everyone else as an emerging problem with your character, mind, or perceptions. This is what gaslighting is about. 

Narcissists are, for the most part, compromise-resistant, and will be manipulating ways to keep you "in the game" without compromising on anything. If they are able to do a little bit of it, I'd bet anything that they'll be giving an inch to your mile in that department, and then try to hoard all of the power again later on.

Again this has to do with the fact that they can't admit they are wrong (it risks their vulnerability), and the entitlement that they have that you have to go along with them no matter how far from the truth they are. 

Narcissists will usually tell you that you are crazy and that no one would ever love you or put up with you except them (they'll try to make themselves out to be eternally patient), and in general they will try to wear down your self esteem and nullify your relationships. This the other gaslighting tactic, trying to make you feel that you are alone and will be surrounded by other attackers as long as you ignore their pleas to do what they tell you to do (make them faultless and make yourself at fault). 

But let's say that the narcissist says that he gave you the silent treatment because he wants you to coddle him, and try to please him more, and he gives you that as the reason for why he went silent on you. 

It is very unlikely he will change the way he treated you before. Because abuse escalates, it'll probably get worse. He is most likely trying to fine-tune the sycophantry and submissiveness that you provide. 

And you may be back in your old role over trauma bonding or co-dependency. There may be finances involved. There may be guilt involved: like the idea that you didn't try hard enough to please him. You might be frightened over a threat he has made. Maybe he is physically abusive and you are aware of the statistics of how many women are killed in the first few weeks of leaving their partner. You may not have a good plan in place on how to escape. Or you may just love the perpetrator. The reasons for staying are endless. 

You may be highly empathic, and every time your partner has a fit, there may be enough affection that you feel guilty for not accepting it. 

After enough of these episodes, and without some respite, or some kind of intervention (like a person who goes to bat for you), you are likely going to have full blown PTSD. 

PTSD symptoms are involuntary, with physical, mental and emotional repercussions.  If you are getting therapy for PTSD, these kinds of scenes (losing keys, silent treatments, and so much more) contribute to why your therapist may be insisting that going "no contact" may be the the only way to heal from the PTSD, and all of the symptoms that are present. It also gets you out of the loop of continual trauma responses, and giving in (bonding over and over again over the perpetrator's inclination to stir up traumatic situations where your life hangs in the balance, or finances, or your work, or children, or pets, or anything that is being threatened by them). 

One of the major symptoms of PTSD is not being able to sleep, of being in a hypervigilant state. At the point you aren't able to sleep, you are keyed up about the next impending false accusations or attacks by your partner. Your anxiety about all of this is such that it is keeping you awake at night. Your partner, on the other hand, may be sleeping just fine. Blowing off steam has regulated them enough so that they feel at peace, contented with the state of things. There is no looming danger to their authority or conscience about how they treat you. This may make them feel better, but for you, it is not only impinging on your happiness, wellbeing on all levels, ability to focus, ability to get through the next day with your best foot forward, it is literally driving you into more and more disability.

And aside from disability, narcissists are often trying to strip away any independence or autonomy you used to enjoy when you made your own decisions, had your own thoughts and feelings without someone countering you with what they want to believe, had your own relationships without the narcissist commenting on them or interfering in them. 

PTSD is a normal condition to being exposed to narcissistic fits day in and day out, but it can also be qualified as a disability, because the symptoms are such that they hobble your day to day ability to function at capacity. In the most severe cases you will be trembling from head to foot, and really won't be able to concentrate on anything people are saying to you, or about you.

To get a semblance of PTSD, try not sleeping for 3 days, and see how you feel. Then add in anxiety about being attacked or told what you think or feel (when you don't feel or think what they believe you do), and try to defend yourself in such a state, or get someone to start a crazy-making erroneous-accusatory argument with you after not sleeping for three days. See how well you do with their accusations, and how they try to manipulate certain negative responses from you. Get the person to rage in your face a few times too, and perhaps insult you in many, many ways (how incompetent you are, that they should just leave you to the dogs, that you never meant anything to them - just tell them to hammer you with this BS until you have that wide-eyed stare, and where you no longer seem to be comprehending what they are raging about). Then have them kick you once for not responding any more. See if your nerves are frayed after that episode, and take note of your symptoms, and imagine that the way they treat you largely goes on day after day, after day, and intermingle it with a few episodes of audacious and very confusing affections. Do you feel weepy? Are you begging them to stop it? And what happens when you ask them to stop it? 

They continue it, right? No one is going to stop them from their God given right to attack! Right? 

Now imagine you are so exhausted that you finally do fall asleep. But you have nightmares about being attacked by them. They are very vivid dreams. And when you wake up, there they are! Looking right at you with more rage in their heart. "You're done with sleeping! Get up and do something useful!" they shout at you. Take note of your symptoms after that. 

I'd bet you'd want to crawl under a rock. I bet you want them to just leave you alone already! Right?

And some of them do leave you alone, but not in a good way. They take all of the money out of your joint account, for instance. Or they get other people to lecture you about what a great, great person your abuser is. They run smear campaigns about you to other people. They taunt you with a new lover perhaps. They bait you about wanting to be left alone, as if that is totally unreasonable: "After all I have done for you," they say, "and all we have meant to each other, you're going to leave me in the lurch!?" - it's another blaming tactic and you're supposed to feel guilty, put your PTSD symptoms on hold somehow just for them, but your PTSD symptoms have the upper hand (usually).

The trauma bond at that point is starting to unravel apart because of the symptoms of PTSD in response to attacks, invalidations, and feeling hostage. Once your flight responses are more numerous than your fawn responses, or freeze responses, you are going to want to leave. It's actually better to leave before you get to that point, because you will leave much less disabled. The more disabled you are, and when you are at the point of thinking "I HAVE to get out of this! I WILL get out of this!" You will most likely have to build a new life from scratch, and the more disabled you are, the harder it will be to take on that monumental challenge. 

And it is monumental. Most survivors of narcissistic abuse go through retaliations by their exes, which again, is very confusing considering how much contempt they have shown you, and usually they are threatening to leave you or giving you the silent treatment, and usually they try to show you that they don't care about your feelings too. So why would they be angry and retaliatory if we leave? 

Some of the answers can be found in Jason Skidmore's video, a man diagnosed with Narcissistic Personality Disorder where admits to doing fake discards. Since narcissists often use other forms of stonewalling and silent treatments with their discards, it leaves it up to the survivor how they are going to interpret and respond to a discard. And what I have seen so far is that they tend to go in the direction of family values and family upbringing and what I mean by this is: Let us say that the recipient of the discard is from a family who thinks their daughter has been treated horribly, that discards have no place in an intimate relationship. She's more likely to take the discard as so unreasonable that it should not be responded to. Then there are other families who want you to talk to your partner, to work things out face to face, and to insist on it, or to go to counseling if both of you do not come to any conclusions, so you might try to talk to them, and report back to your family to get more advice from them. The other side of the coin are abusive families who expect women to beg their men to take them back, and sometimes, but not as often, for men to beg women to take them back - it's one way to ensure a trauma bond will go on and on. And then there are families with so many estranged members that the message is that if you attempt a return, nothing will work out, that there are no resolutions and that there is nothing you can do about it. 

Or let us say that you read survivor forums and go to meetings with other domestic abuse survivors and it becomes clear that not only were there no resolutions for the high number of cases (or quite often all of the cases), where the abuse got much, much worse when they went back. In some of these cases you will find that it became a life-threatening situation. 

To make matters worse, at the point of the discard, narcissists usually play the victim as well as spread more false narratives to get their co-bullies, enablers, and sycophants to attack you, or to tell you of the dire straights you left them in (when most likely they DARVO'd you). There will be all kinds of social pressures to get you back into the trauma bond again. It's a huge betrayal on the discarder's part, and for most victims, it seems scary, like how criminals act when they get caught and want to make it someone else's fault. My sense is that DARVOs don't work in bringing any survivor back; in fact, it creates a lot more barriers.

Then there are narcissists who get fixated on beliefs about you. The least obnoxious is that they believe that you have a permanent flaw of ingratitude. In fact, if you watch other videos by narcissists, they become quite fixated on that - and there are videos by Jason Skidmore of "The Nameless Narcissist" (mentioned above) where he talks about gaining leadership positions and being a mastermind in some games in friendship circles in high school and college where his friends bailed on him, and on how it hurt him greatly, where his mind went in the direction of wanting to hurt them for the "ingratitude" he perceived they had.  

But I have to say that it usually gets way worse than fixations of only "perceived ingratitude". After listening to so many survivor stories about the kinds of things perpetrators say about their victims, it can get really "far out". For instance, one parent became absolutely convinced that her daughter was bringing home fake report cards from school (because she was convinced her daughter was stupid), and even when her daughter told her mother to contact the teacher to see if the report card was real, the mother would find other ways to justify her belief such as the daughter talking the teacher into giving her better grades than she deserved, trying to play teacher's pet, and threatening the teacher. If perpetrators believe, or are stubborn about holding on to a false belief, you are not going to be able to say much without repercussions (whether they rage at you for convincing them or others that they were wrong - which narcissists hate - or they do everything they can to ignore the truth).

Another survivor's family was convinced that their physician family member was a clandestine prostitute on the side (and eventually it was found that the mother in that situation was a prostitute and assumed her physician daughter was one too). So a lot of it is projection.

Another survivor's family from a right wing community told all of the relatives that their daughter ran off with Antifa and was living in an LGBTQ commune when the real truth was that she left because of on-going physical abuse by her father as well as his propensity to continually make up things about her, isolating her further and further with him. What really happened is that she moved far away, was never part of a liberal community, and didn't know a single LGBTQ person, and was living alone scared out of her mind in an apartment. She was scared that her father's family and friends would beat her up over false accusations. In that case, it would seem the message was clear: "don't come back". Otherwise why make up such stories about his own daughter?

The most dangerous one was where a survivor went back to her abuser and the abuser beat her up badly at the doorway. She managed to get away and was hospitalized, but it became a case where the abuser believed he was in danger from the abused because if he had been abused like she was, he would have tried to kill the person who abused him. 

So part of the trauma bond is living continuously with fantasies, false narratives, dangerous assumptions and diabolical lies to get others to threaten you, abuse you, or kill you. And guess what? You often won't know which one it is. There are some signs, like the DARVO that can immediately put you on "DISTRUST ALERT", but most survivors are usually really surprised at how far their abusers will go to hurt them.

And, of course, narcissists can have Narcissistic Collapse where they feel that their egos or the image they are trying to portray to others is in immediate jeopardy, where they feel they will never be able to reach the heights they did before (even if those heights were illusory and were only propped by manipulations of other people), and where they can be on a mission to hurt a person, or type of people that remind them of someone who they believe provoked their narcissistic collapse. 

In that way, abusers can be like preppers. Preppers are known to build long tunnels on their property and store them full of food because they believe that a situation is building where their lives are under threat from world events out of their control. The one difference between them and abusers is that abusers "prep" for an attack by their victim.

It can be one of the reasons they attack you without provocation. It can be one of the reasons they spread false narratives and insist that people believe them, and protect them from phantom ostracism and victimization.

It can be one of the reasons they indulge in so many false narratives, as if you'll spread lies about them first and they'll be left without friends or family or a support group, so they do it to you as soon as they think you are not coming back.

It can be one of the reasons why they always left you out of social situations, or isolated you from family, or why they decided on estrangement over continuing the relationship they had with you, or why they took you out of their Will, because they falsely believe you will be trashing them and being as scary as they are. 

And it may even have to do with why they rage at you or abuse you if they perceive they have been criticized by you - because when they criticize there are many, many agendas behind their criticisms including trying to dominate you, take away your decision-making, take away your relationships, and take away your freedoms.

What this has to do with is that a lot of narcissists are paranoid, and some even have Paranoid Personality Disorder (another link), in addition to Narcissistic Personality Disorder, which tends to be the more malignant brand of narcissism where there is sadism and/or violence being expressed. The combination can be deadly, so it may be best not to go back, at least to a private residence (if they tell you they want to talk to you, consider a public place). If they are spreading a lot of false narratives about you (smear campaigns) that seem really delusional with a lot of false victim stories, you can see why this might be dangerous.

You would think that with all of the blaming, contempt, criticisms and insults they have for you that they would be happy that you left, or that they instigated a silent treatment, but the fact is that, as Dr. Ramani said in her video (and which I transcribed above), "It's always important to remember that narcissistic folks always use conflict to regulate. The yelling and screaming and abuse allow them to reassert their power, and as they shatter you, they feel better."

In other words, they need you back in your role, taking blame and abuse so that they can feel regulated and in charge. Perhaps when they feel they can't use you as a rage receptacle, they discard and use the DARVO. This also has everything to do with why they gaslight. If we were to add gaslighting to Dr. Ramani's tale, the gaslighting would sound like: "You know, you're so crazy that you didn't know you lost my keys. You go around and take things of mine, and then put them in my coat pocket on purpose so that you know I'm not going to find them." 

Gaslighting just gets you to PTSD symptoms a lot faster.  

Narcissists do not care about PTSD, and the symptoms and disabilities it presents. If they are instructed by a health care provider or mental health counselor about strategies to keep a peaceful, calm environment, they don't do it. They look at PTSD as a weakness, in fact, and something that is inconvenient. They have a love/hate relationship with you, just as they do any disabled person. A disability to them means: a limited amount of narcissistic supply where they can rage and insult like crazy, where the disabled person is too disabled to defend themselves against the attacks, but cannot do much more for them than that. Any other potential ego trips are stifled by the disability. 

I taught school, and the disabled are often picked to bully the most because they have fewer defenses and less of a network of peer support than the bullies do (usually). Bullies aren't going to look at an individual with PTSD differently than someone with a physical disability. On the playground, they might refer to a child with PTSD as "stupid", "retarded" (because children with PTSD are often amygdala hijacked). In terms of the amygdala hijack, it means the capacity to learn has been hijacked by hypervigilance, and walking on eggshells to temper the narcissist's clockwork rages). They may be referred to as "a baby" because children with PTSD tend to cry a lot more, and can appear inconsolable and unaffected even when they are comforted or teased about their crying. That is because they are literally living in pain most of the time. They can be described as a kid "no one likes" because kids with PTSD tend to isolate and not trust others. 

In terms of adult bullying, many of the same kinds of phrases will be lobbed at the partner, but they might say things like "intellectually challenged", or "insane", or "socially inept" - the more grown up phrases. Or they may say things which denigrate your PTSD: "Oh, here we go again! Your PTSD is activated again! You know, I've just about had it with your PTSD! You've got excuses to cry and be spacey again! Boohoo! But guess what!? I didn't activate it! You're a weak person who can't take a little argument! Or an insult! Such a baby! Waaahhhhh!!!!"

In terms of the way adults bully, it is not much different than the way kids engage in schoolyard bullying.

I will talk about the set of traits that attract other bullies in another post. Every scapegoat, and ex-partner of a narcissist, should learn what those traits are so that you can work on them, and so that narcissists won't even notice you, and hopefully not want a relationship with you either. 

Anyway, the PTSD symptoms can go off every time the narcissist is around you: headaches, stomach aches, a deep kind of exhaustion, anxiety through the roof, your heart may even hurt or pound, and you can't even pay attention to what they are saying any more because your own body and mind are all that you can deal with. You feel like you are under constant siege, onslaught, hostage to their nitpicking and rages. And you may get to the point where you don't care about the narcissist any more than they care about you. You just want to escape and get out of the situation. 

If you stay, your symptoms get even worse. You may feel like you can barely function. So escaping is going to cross all of our minds eventually. 

None of us are meant to be under constant onslaught (and having nightmares about a partner, not sleeping, flinching over being touched, and doubled over with stomach aches) in a marriage. 

I came across this from researcher and popular book author, Shahida Arabi, on Facebook: "How is it that narcissists and psychopaths can love bomb their partners so heavily, only to suddenly withdraw, devalue, or attempt to “replace” one person with another? Why do you feel like the narcissist or psychopath no longer “sees” you, is bored with you or that you cease to exist when you challenge the narcissist’s ego by standing up for yourself? Psychologists have a surprising answer to these questions."

This ends up at her Thought Catalog article, The Reason Narcissists Love Bomb and Devalue Their Partners So Easily, According to Psychology. 
     Here is an excerpt from her article (written in blue):
     You’ve heard of the phrase, "out of sight, out of mind." But did you know it applies to the mindset of narcissistic and psychopathic individuals? Object constancy is a term to describe the ability to maintain a consistent perception of objects or people regardless of whether they are physically present or if there are changes to their behaviors, emotional states, or appearance.  For example, children exhibit object constancy when they begin to realize that when their parent has left the room, they have not abandoned them and will usually return. Adults have an expanded sense of object constancy in their relationships, as they are able to still maintain bonds and relationships to people even during minor, temporary conflicts or experiencing emotions of being upset at the person. Psychologists have suggested that narcissistic people can have a distorted sense of emotional “object constancy,” in relationships, which means they can devalue people they once put on a pedestal quite easily because they refuse to hold the simultaneous state of loving and maintaining a bond with someone, while also being upset with them. 
     However, as a researcher specializing in narcissism, I would say it’s more accurate to include that not only do narcissists have a distorted sense of object constancy, they also lack empathy and have an excessive sense of entitlement. These are the driving forces behind their harmful and aggressive behaviors. “Out of sight, out of mind” applies to them emotionally because if their ego is harmed or sense of entitlement rattled, they begin to devalue the very partners they once love bombed heavily without much empathy or remorse, not caring how building a close relationship with someone and then suddenly pretending that person doesn’t exist may affect the other person. 
     This lack of object constancy, lack of empathy, and distorted emotional permanence is also what drives narcissistic and psychopathic people to pit people against one other and maintain a harem of people to “play” with. They seem to devalue other people at the drop of a hat to pursue someone or something they deem more novel or exciting at a moment’s notice.  Narcissists do this because they are attracted to status and prestige, so they’re always on the lookout for people who can boost their image. They place people into categories of “high value” and “low value” based on what these people can do for them or offer to them at the time. That is why it may seem arbitrary and off-putting when they once put you on a pedestal, making you feel important and cherished, only to suddenly pursue another target.
     People who were married to narcissistic individuals can attest to the shock and betrayal they experienced, when, after being the object of the narcissist’s affections and hyper-fixation, they were suddenly devalued or triangulated with another target. Or, partners of narcissists share how they experienced the rage, gaslighting, stonewalling or silent treatment of the narcissist when they stood up to the narcissist, because the narcissist does not allow themselves to keep both states of, “I still have a close relationship with this person and love them,” and “They have hurt my ego,” in mind at the same time. Narcissistic individuals often opt to focus instead on how that person has challenged their ego and entitlement, rather than focus on how this bond can be improved with their partner’s feedback, or create an even stronger bond with more trust and vulnerability. ... 

The whole article is worth reading. 

The point of showing her article to you is that for a person who is not a narcissist or psychopath, this will cause trauma. The rest of us are not built to invest hours every day, and years of our time into a relationship that can go "non-existent" in a second over our partner's ego issues, or because they compulsively decided we are "too low value" for them. 

Okay, so let us say that we get that they have devalued us to "low stature", and we move on with our lives.

But sometimes narcissists circle back around to us because we might do something that gives them a double take. Maybe you are in a relationship with someone who is deemed to be "high value" to them. They might even be afraid that the other person is of higher stature than they are. Or we make a lot of money at something, which makes them feel insecure (that we are on a higher hierarchy of money than they are). I think any number of us can count the times narcissists "showed up" suddenly - one woman I know had an art show and her estranged cruel mother decided to show up to it, and wanted to buy all of the paintings. It was very possible that she wanted to buy the paintings to destroy them because she had destroyed most of her daughter's paintings before.

It can happen with exes too, and someone who had been cruel to me (complete with discard) just happened to show up (with a gift) when he heard the news that I was involved in a project that he had always said he wanted to be a part of. I knew enough about narcissism by then not to trust him at all. 

If narcissists decide to come back at some point, you can see from Arabi's article that they are not doing so for good reasons. It is either to enact a kind of Trojan Horse of reinstating the love bombing to get revenge or to enact a retaliation for their bruised ego, or because they want your success, or because they miss your brand of narcissistic supply and think you can help elevate them by the company you keep. Love for them means "You are of some utility to me"; it does not mean what the rest of us mean. 

If you do accept them a second time, I think you'll see that they'll do another discard no matter what they promise (narcissists do not keep promises, especially these kind). They might keep a promise for the most mundane of matters, and even there they make excuses and slip up. 

The second time they come back and do another discard it can be quite a bit more traumatic than the first time. What I have seen and heard in asking survivors of narcissistic abuse how they survived narcissistic discards twice are these take-aways. If you are discarded in your late teens or early twenties, and are never tempted to go back, you have the best chance of healing, leading a normal happy life, not obsessing over a discard, and building your life from scratch. You can forget about the people who hurt you more easily. If you are discarded again by that same person in middle age, or in your fifties or sixties, it is much, much harder, and I bet PTSD symptoms are through the roof too. Perhaps it is because we are built in such a way where when we are 18 - 20 years old, our lives are more about exploring a grown up world and peer relationships, and moving around a lot, and constantly getting to know new people, that to get bogged down in a toxic partnership/marriage is not as likely. The testosterone levels tend to be higher then for both men and women. You can move on from them more easily because most people in their late teens and early twenties have fluid changeable lives any way, and you are at your healthiest to endure what ever trauma symptoms may temporarily plague you. 

It does not always happen this way, however. When I was in my early twenties and part of a friendship circle of people my own age in my city, a young man from the group had been suddenly, and without explanation, discarded by his girlfriend, and hung himself after pleading with her numerous times to talk to him. I thought about him more than usual because another friend I saw a lot rented the apartment where he hung himself. I ruminated about his self esteem, whether his self esteem had been knocked down in childhood or in his teens before he met his girlfriend, or if it had only been knocked down by her. I never found the answer. 

The specter of suicide can be an issue. Seconds-long discards with cruelty behind them, and the silent treatment following the discard, and lots of stonewalling can, in some cases, produce a suicide. While most of us would care about that, be concerned with how he was handling the issue, and be effected by his suicide (certainly the friendship circle did), I somehow doubt that a narcissist would. As long as they feel they can say "It wasn't my fault" they move on. 

IN RELATIONSHIPS WITH CHILDREN

Obviously children experiencing a trauma bond with a parent or other care-taking adult, and an on-going cycle of the false narrative blaming cycle is going to be tremendously damaging to the child. It is nothing better than a hostage situation. And because children don't have choices like adults have, and because the power imbalance is so wide, the likelihood of child abuse, even physical abuse over the false things they are blamed for, is high. 

On their own, children don't have many choices when they are falsely accused. The only way that they might get help is through another adult calling Child Protective Services or a mandated reporter knowing that a child is being mistreated over a parent's false accusations continually. 

And narcissistic parents tend to falsely accuse other people and their own children (or more often their scapegoat child) a lot so that they don't have to feel shame. In a way, that is why they give a hug or some other form affection at the end of their diatribes (after they have found the car keys in their own pocket after accusing their child of taking them, for instance). It keeps them from having to apologize, admit that they are wrong, admit that they are hurting a child, admit that they are damaging a child with these continuous cycles of false accusations, or admit that any shame can be attributed to them. It is probably also done to ensure to themselves that they still have a bond with the child. 

But the damage is more likely to be extreme with children. All children are afraid of their parents going missing or abandoning them. All children are afraid that their parent won't be able to provide for them (food, clothing, shelter, teaching life skills). All children are afraid of divorce (for good reason). All children are afraid of punishments, especially unjust ones. All children are afraid of not being liked or loved by a parent (shown contempt or criticized instead). All children are afraid of adult rage and violence. All children are afraid of being so dependent on adults for their survival. All children are afraid that this survival dependence is also tied to attention and love from a parent (that it can be taken away). All children are afraid that if a parent doesn't love them that supervision, being fair, being protective and putting safety first, being just, being emotionally self regulated will be taken away -  and that if the parent isn't adult enough to take on challenges that a child cannot handle because of their age and size, then that can be pretty scary too. - there is a reason I wrote this in red ... 

Narcissists know these fears because they were once a child too. But they are more likely to play on these fears, take advantage of the fears, and use them repeatedly as threats, in dog-whistling comments, in head games, in manipulations, in power trips, and some parents, especially narcissistic parents who have some sociopathic qualities, actually go through with all or most of them to show a child (even an adult child) that the parent doesn't really love them, need them or want them. 

If one or two of these things from the list (in red above) is missing, like a parent not being able to provide for them, it is challenging for a child. It can also be traumatic depending on how bad it is. If half of them are missing, the child is walking around on eggshells wondering when the next crisis will happen. If all of them are missing, it is a game changer and PTSD is inevitable, as well as a really, really sick, toxic, and dangerous (for the child) trauma bond. 

Let me say it this way:

So let us say that the parent is a rage-a-holic, that any kind of consistent love is missing, that they are violent, that they don't protect you from the violence of others, that they provide meals that aren't particularly nutritious (like feed you boxed cereal for breakfast and dinner, where you get a real meal from school lunch or the neighbors), where they are telling you that they are going to get a divorce from a parent who actually loves you, where they tell you that you "Can run away any old time" or threaten to abandon you, that's only half of the issues above that you are forced to deal with. I would argue that one or two of these issues, like improper physical care coupled with an angry temper, is too much for children to deal with. But if you add in all of the rest of the ingredients from that paragraph, with even more like: erroneous unfounded blaming, gaslighting, silent treatments, some actual abandonments, actual withdrawals of love over short or long periods of time, hyper-criticisms, contempt for who the child is and the way they do things, comparing the child negatively to siblings or other children, and all of the other ingredients from that paragraph, it is way too overwhelming for any child, even the strongest most resilient of them. Then if you add in more than I have mentioned like exposing the child to a parent's alcoholism or drug addictions or to family members with those issues, being abused by others with no protection or resolution from the adults, retaliatory or tit-for-tat parenting, false imprisonment, sexual abuse, war, street violence, more criticism than love, that child is going to have PTSD so severe that it is likely to be life long. It can be mitigated in adulthood with trauma therapy, domestic violence therapy, and going "no contact" with people who display more than a few narcissistic traits, but it will never go away completely ... absolutely calm environments are the best bet. Even there it is not full proof: too many human beings seem to want to start wars, retaliate, start pointless grand-standing arguments, and destroy ... 

And by the way, most scapegoat children of families have to live with more of a predominance of the fears (that end up coming true) listed in the red paragraph. It's no wonder that so many scapegoats I have met all seem to go "no contact" and are "nature bugs". Humans are difficult animals to cope with, and especially when you've been brought up with so many loud arguments that never go in a positive direction (mainly because narcissists require that they chronically get their own way), you can't hear any more rages, criticisms, DARVOs, loud arguments, without symptoms or blanking out altogether. 

So how do trauma-bonded, scapegoated children act? 

There are so many symptoms other than an inability to sleep, headaches, stomach aches, nightmares and anxiety, that I'll take that up in other posts when I get more into the trauma section of the blog. At the very least, it can impact the developing brain, and all of that hypervigilance can effect the heart too (medical issues with the heart can happen early in life even if you have a good diet, and stay away from smoking, alcohol and caffeine). It is what Bessel van der Kolk writes about, and particularly for the well know book he wrote called "The Body Keeps the Score". 

All of the anxiety, hypervigilance, being on the powerless end of the relationship, being abused, condescended, insulted, used for diabolical  purposes, and abandoned can have significant medical issues sooner or later. 

In the meantime, here are some healthy videos and writings by various psychologists, researchers and experts: 

VIDEOS
(WITH SOME OF MY OWN COMMENTS)

"What Do Narcissists Gain by Your Trauma Bond"
by Dr. Les Carter for the Surviving Narcissism channel:

I have transcribed his video so that you can study his words carefully (his words are in a mustard color):

When you hear the concept of trauma bonding relative to a relationship with a narcissist, we often and rightly will focus on the difficult experiences that you have because of the narcissist's behavior towards you, and it's so necessary for you to understand the dynamic of trauma bonds. 

Today I want to help you find out how you're going to manage your end of the trauma bond with a narcissist by understanding what's going on inside of them, what they feel like they are gaining from having their side of the trauma bond with you. 

Now before we get too deep into all of that, let's first remind ourselves what we're talking about when we refer to having a trauma bond. When we talk about psychological trauma, basically we're talking about you receiving so much negative stimulation in that moment, you simply don't have the bandwidth, you don't have the inner wherewithal to process what's going on in front of you. It's too over-powering. And then we can add the word "complex trauma" and that implies that the trauma repeats itself over, and over, and over. Now when you have a trauma bond, basically what we're talking about is a relationship that's based upon a strong power differential. And guess what that equation you're on. 

Narcissists have an on-going need to keep you in the "down position". They're going to argue with you a whole lot. They can have major anger when ever you try to have a dialogue with them regarding any difference or difficulty. You're not going to have a constructive dialog at all. There is lots of character assassination. These individuals have a vested interest in keeping you feeling inadequate, or inferior. They'll put guilt and shame upon you. And specifically when I talk about shame, they want to keep you believing that your character is truly defective. They demand blind loyalty. They have extremely strong control features in the way that they come toward you. And lots of double standards. They'll isolate you from other individuals. As you can tell just from this description, a word that we often use relating to the trauma bonding is "toxic". This is a toxic way of engaging with other individuals. 

When we're talking about trauma bonds, we're talking unhealthy attachments that are on-going. 

Now I know that on your side of the equation, you can readily relate to certain feelings or experiences. You might end up trying to filter your decisions or priorities through that narcissist. "Well, am I going to set this person off?" Sometimes you just wonder "What's the next false move that I might make that's going to get them angry at me?" So you become guarded and calculating. You can commonly feel very angry in reverse towards them, and you can have a build up of hurt and pain, and resentment, and all that goes with that. Often there can even be times when you feel the need to cover for the narcissist's anger towards you because you can feel so embarrassed and humiliated by the experiences that you have. 

But then let's go to that question - we know that this has a debilitating effect on you - but what's in it for the narcissist? What are they hoping to gain by creating this illicit form of bonding with you? And it's so essential for you to understand what's in their mind, what drives them because the narcissist definitely wants you to think you're "the problem". When in fact, no, what's going on is that they're carrying a great deal - and when I say a great deal - of psychological damage from the inside out, but they want you to think you are deficient because of heir unwillingness to examine themselves.
(4:50)

So what does the narcissist gain by keeping you bonded in this traumatic kind of way? 

Now first, let's begin with the understanding that the trauma bond between the narcissist and you is all about the narcissist's pain management strategy. 

Now you may think that is truly strange. You see, these individuals are already damaged individuals in their own right. Frankly many of them are already living in their own version of Hell and some of the ones who grew up as the golden child already want to perpetuate the myth that they are special. But make no mistake. They operate with an illogic: "The way for me to manage my pain is to make you have more pain. The way to make me feel like an adequate person is to make you feel inadequate. When you are down, then I feel validated. I'm not as pitiable as you."

And so as a result, narcissists in their own strange pain management try to fend off their pain by putting it on to you. And they feed off of the fact that you're hurting because it's a way of reminding themselves, "See, there's the inadequate person right there."

Much of this is going on in a subconscious level, but none-the-less this is their strange psychological math: "I get rid of my pain by making you feel pain."

Now in addition, I mentioned trauma bonds are based upon a power differential. One of the things narcissists feel like they gain by maintaining the bond with you is it becomes a compensation of their own fear of powerlessness. In the mind of the narcissist, their assumption is that relationships are based upon dominance and submission. That's the psychological language they learn and so they've thought to themselves, "Well, I definitely don't want to be on the submissive end of it, so I'll be on the dominate end of it", and they will come at you with all sorts of power tactics, because they must keep you in subjection and subordination to them to build up their pitiable weak ego.

Another thing we can say is that narcissists carry on the inside - and again it can be that they won't admit this necessarily - but they carry a great deal psychological fatigue. You know and I know that relationships carry a great deal of work and concentration and patience for them to unfold for us to build a solid foundation, and narcissists have the thought, "I don't have time for all of that! I don't want to put in the work; I don't want to invest myself not knowing what the outcome is going to be", so in their psychological fatigue they go straight to the finish line and say, "Look, let's just establish that I'm good and you're not good. I'm excellent; you're terrible." And they refuse to live in the patience that's required to establish a healthy love of respect and honor. It just doesn't happen overnight. But to the narcissist it's like "I don't have time for that."

In addition, narcissists harbor a lot of self directed insults. And again, this is not what they will say out loud to you. But in their mind, they "Hate what people have done to me. And they think I'm going to take the inadequate side of the equation? No way!" Instead what they'll do is to go in the opposite direction and say, "Well, I'll tell you what. I actually hate what you are!" And it takes them away from hearing the message that says "People out there have rejected me. I just reject you." It's again, a compensation.

Or they can think to themselves, "I've been subjected to much judgement and condemnation, or being on the outside looking in, so if I can make you look worse than me, I'll be happy to judge you." And so they need you to be inadequate to take the focus off of their own internal psychological confusion, which is why they put so much psychological energy in to keeping you down. All of that anger, and all of that brash, and pushy and contemptuous way of living - it is all a part of their compensation for their inner sense of inadequacy. They have an empty interior. They do not have a well-conceived philosophy of what brings meaning or purpose to life. Instead it's all about being on a grading system, and they have to be on the high end, which means they require you to be on the low end. 

So, we go back to that question: "What does the narcissist gain by keeping you trauma bonded to them?" 

They gain a diversion from their own inner confusion. They gain the capacity to go into denial of their own fears and hurts (like: "That's not me!").

They gain dominance as a cover for their powerlessness.

And so much of what they do is such a matter of projection - they see in you all of the confusion that they refuse to come to terms with on the inside of themselves, and then along with projection, they love to gaslight. In other words, if they can keep you confused about what's really going on, they win. And so what we're trying to do here is to clear up some of that gaslighting, and remind us that the world view that they have is so inappropriate, and it is so illogical. 

I mean, for example, "My self respect arises from insulting you." That doesn't make sense. 

Or "My feeling of power arises from wiping out your ability to make decisions."

Or "My sense of pleasure is derived from you having pain." 

Or "My hostility I have on the inside is satisfied by displacing it on to another individual." 

I mean their whole world view makes no sense what-so-ever. So, basically by understanding what is going on inside the narcissist as they try to keep you bonded to them, I'm hoping that you can see that you're being used. And you're being used to prop up their poorly constructed interior. And you know, "If I'm on the receiving end of all of the messages and the abuse and condescension that goes with this, my response is, 'I didn't sign up for this. This doesn't help me, and frankly it doesn't help the narcissist, therefor I'm going to withdraw from the role that was assigned to me without my permission. I need my freedom.'" 

... I so want you to break free from the bonds that the narcissist holds you into. ... 

"THIS Is What Trauma Bonding With A Narcissist Does To A Decent Person"
by Dr. Les Carter for the Surviving Narcissism channel:

I have transcribed his video up until 7:13 so that you can study his words carefully (his words are in a mustard color):

... When you've been bonded with a malignant narcissist (inevitably that's who this person would be), it takes such a toll on you that you begin to wonder is "Is there something really and deficient about me?"

That's part of what trauma bonding does. 

And I'm here to tell you "No." You have to understand that the problem that happens with trauma bonding is that with a very pathological person, who themselves is very disturbed and dis-regulated, they are the problem. They want you to think you're the problem, and it's so necessary for you to see what they do to you so that you can recognize it is more about them than it is about you. So we need to adjust some of the thoughts and feelings that you carry about yourself. 

Now before we get into that, I've actually read quite a few comments I have seen from people who have been in trauma bonds, but let's remind ourselves what we're talking about when we use that term "trauma bonding". 

Basically the person who has been trauma bonded feels very self limited. They are mentally and emotionally exhausted and they feel very unworthy specifically because of an ongoing toxic relationship with a hyper controlling narcissist, a master manipulator. And one of the things we know about trauma bonding is that as time passes, the recipient of that toxicity begins to feel weaker and weaker relative to the narcissist, and of course the giver of the toxicity, the narcissist, becomes more and more diabolical. By the way, do you understand the meaning of the word, diabolical? We also have "diablo" in other languages. But it comes from a Latin root word that just means "the devil." It's evil. And it's truly evil when a malignant narcissist in their malignant mannerisms says "I need to make sure you know who's in charge around here." They grind you into the ground. They want you to have little to no belief in yourself, because they are going to fill you with them. And so the narcissist demands your subjugation ... Over time when you've been around someone that long, you become habituated to the game that they go to. You're trying to seek peace to get rid of conflict, that you feel that if you do leave, then you're disloyal, you're wrong or somehow you're the impossible one - that's the bond that happens. You stay stuck to them because the malignant narcissist lets you know "If you do something away from me then that means there is something terrible about you. You need to stay underneath my subjection."

Now I have a whole list here. I just sat down at my desk and I wrote it out and these are comments I've received from viewers such as yourself and from other individuals I've spoken with and I want to read these to you. And as I do, I want to see if you can identify with some or maybe all of these comments because this is what happens to a decent person when they have been trauma bonded to a narcissist, inevitably a malignant narcissist. Here we go - 

... "I totally lost myself. I can't tell you how hard I've tried to hold the relationship together. I constantly felt it was my job to make peace. Nothing, and I mean nothing, ever satisfied that person. I had to choose to be a 'yes person' or face serious wrath."
How many of you have worried about that one?
"There was lots of verbal abuse and constant shame."

You know what that's like?

"After all of the controlling demands, I would be left wondering 'Who am I? And how the Hell did I get here? I had to Comply," with a capital "C, "to that person. And I hated it. My worth, my self respect weren't just stolen, they were trampled upon. To this day, I struggle with doubt and profound grief." 

These are words from people who have been in trauma bonds. 

"I feel like damaged goods. Will I ever be accepted or lovable again?"

"I was told repeatedly if I left, 'it will not end well for you.' I felt so alone. I had to get away from the toxic fumes, but I felt terrified."

You know, I read through these kinds of comments and there are more and I know that many of you can recall or add to the list here. I read through comments like this and I'm thinking, "Yea. This is what happens. This is what trauma bonding does to a decent person. That narcissist who has such a strong control agenda and has somehow convinced himself or herself that it's a reasonable thing to grind you into the ground - they give you so many messages and there are so many experiences where they rob you of your own decency, that this is what happens to an otherwise decent individual." 

And I want you to understand that if you've been on the receiving end of this, you don't have to stay. We call it "trauma BONDING" - the narcissist wants to bond to you, but it really is okay to say "No! No! I can't do this." And so I want to give you a few thoughts here. If you've been associated with a narcissist who has tried to bond you to them through this trauma and toxicity, I'm going to see how we can figure out how to get away from that. ...    

When Dr. Carter talks about some of his clients, or the people leaving comments, who feel like they are half a person, an invisible person, a person they don't know or recognize within themselves is called an "echoist state". Who you are is constantly about a narrative that the narcissist has decided to be in control of, so it causes internal confusion: "Am I really as terrible as the narcissist says I am?" No, but that is their agenda in a trauma bond - to constantly make you feel that you are not up to their standards. They are judging you in the extreme to the point where you no longer recognize your version of who you are and sometimes their version of who you are either. You are confused, and in most cases you don't have time to think, because they have some other criticism to present to you. That's another subject I hope to take up soon too. 

In the rest of the video he tells how to psychologically break the trauma bond by noting that it is not your duty to protect, defend, constantly apologize to, be loyal to, and stay with a person who is continually putting you down, attributing the worst qualities to you, who treats you like you don't matter past what you can do to regulate their rage and need for power and control, and who is grinding you down to take control of you in every way they possibly can regardless of how it is making you feel (a very diminished version of yourself, or not knowing who you are at all other than the narcissist's constant overbearing berating and shaming sessions). 

The following video by Lisa A. Romano, a life coach specializing in healing from narcissistic abuse, is so good! Not only does she explain what is going on, she consistently has a warm compassionate delivery:

 RECOMMENDED:
"BREAKING TRAUMA BONDS WITH A NARCISSIST/" WHY it's SO HARD TO LEAVE A NARCISSISTIC RELATIONSHIP
by Lisa A. Romano, Life Coach:

"SIGNS YOU'RE IN A TRAUMA BOND AND TRAUMA TRANCE" - by Dr. Kim Sage (You Tube)

8 SIGNS OF MAMA TRAUMA BONDING: COMPLEX PTSD AND BORDERLINE/NARCISSISTIC RELATIONSHIPS WITH MOMS - by Dr. Kim Sage (You Tube)

5 Tips to Help Support Someone with a Trauma Bond - by Doctor Donnelly Snipes (You Tube)

12 Potent Strategies Narcissist Use to Sabotage Breakup Attempts. "Humanization" Trick & Others - by psychologist Ross Rosenberg (You Tube)

Origins of Codependency (Self-Love Deficit Disorder). Recorded 2012. EMM = Pathological Narcissist - by psychologist Ross Rosenberg (You Tube)

12 Steps to Overcome the "Narcissistic Storm." Safely & Strategically Setting Boundaries - by psychologist Ross Rosenberg (You Tube)

Narcissistic Parents: When 'Honoring' Them HURTS you - by Jerry Wise, MA, MS, CLC (You Tube) 

Narcissistic Parents: The Damage of their RAGE & Explosive Outbursts - by Jerry Wise, MA, MS, CLC (You Tube) 

Narcissistic Parents: Ways You Are Invisible to Them - by Jerry Wise, MA, MS, CLC (You Tube) 

8 Signs Its A Trauma Bond, Not Love - Psych2Go (a consortium of psychologists), You Tube 

FURTHER READING

Traumatic Bonding - Wikipedia

6 Signs of Trauma Bonding - by Jenna Fletcher and medically reviewed by Lori Lawrenz, Ph.D. for Psych Central

Breaking the Trauma Bond Forged by Narcissistic Parents (Tips for undoing a dysfunctional parent's hold on you.) - by Suzanne Degges-White, Ph.D. for Psychology Today

Narcissistic Parent - Wikipedia 

Narcissists Use Trauma Bonding and Intermittent Reinforcement To Get You Addicted To Them: Why Abuse Survivors Stay - by Shahida Arabi, MA for Psych Central

How Having a Narcissistic Parent Impacts Young Adult Mental Health - Newport Institute (treatment center)

What Does a Trauma Bond with a Narcissist Look Like? - Mental Health Center of San Diego

PSYCHOLOGY AND RELATIONSHIPS (There are 2 styles of parenting that lead kids to become narcissistic adults, says psychologist who’s treated dozens of them) - by Aditi Shikant for CNBC (Make It section)

Break Free of the Trauma Bonds in Narcissistic Abuse - by Jay Reid, psychotherapist for his own website

10 Shocking Ways To Break A Trauma Bond With A Narcissist - by Shahida Arabi for Thought Catalog

7 Stages of Trauma Bonding: Why Leaving Is Hard and How to Stop It - by Gyenn Ow for Sofia Wellness Clinic

Are You in a Trauma Bond? - Lexie (Children and Family Worker) for Safer Places, UK

FOUND ON FACEBOOK

from NICABM on Facebook:

also from NICABM on Facebook:

From Shahida Arabi
Note: This one seems to be said to the gaslighters and not the gaslit: